Scottish Women’s Budget Group – Women’s poverty and involvement in selling sex go hand in hand
To better understand the money and poverty issues faced by women who sell or exchange sex, we met with Heather Williams, Training Lead at the Scottish Women’s Budget Group. Heather has vast experience at the strategic, managerial and frontline level in some of the main violence against women’s organisations in Scotland.
In this interview, Heather delves into the complexities of money and poverty that can drive women into the ‘sex industry.’ We also discuss things frontline workers must consider when supporting women who are struggling financially and who are thinking or are already involved in selling or exchanging sex.
Could you start by telling us more about your experience working in the women’s sector?
I have been working in the women’s sector for about twenty years in a variety of roles primarily in the violence against women sector, including Women's Aid, Rape Crisis, the Encompass Network and Women’s Support Project. Within the Scottish Women's Budget Group I am the Training Lead, which involves delivering training to professionals in different public bodies as well as women’s community groups to look at inequality in their area and how gender budgeting approaches can help them to improve decisions that are taken which affect their lives.
What about the work you’ve done around women who sell or exchange sex?
I have also worked directly with women who sell or exchange sex. In the past, I’ve managed the Vice Versa service in Dundee which is one of the services in Scotland providing specific support to women involved. I've also supported the Encompass Network of specialist services; and I undertook frontline work at a Women’s Aid group , and some of the women I supported there were involved in selling or exchanging sex for a variety of reasons – some had been pressurised by partners and others got involved because of poverty, to cover bills or to fund their substance use.
In the Scottish Women's Budget Group (SWBG) you look at economics, poverty and financial inequality, which are things we don’t talk about enough when thinking of gender-based violence, can you tell me more about this perspective?
We talk a lot about violence against women being a cause and consequence of gender inequality, but what do we actually mean by that? We need to think about how those systemic and structural issues at times entrap women and play into the dependency that makes women more vulnerable to experiencing violence and abuse.
When we talk about vulnerabilities, we often see it as if there’s something wrong with the individual. But actually these are systemic issues that are responsible for causing some of the vulnerabilities that can increase women's risk of experiencing violence and abuse.
Money is one of the main things in people’s minds when thinking about women who sell sex, and there is often an assumption that selling sex is ‘easy money’. In your experience, what is the reality for women?
Gender inequality means that women are less likely to have savings or access to wealth generally within society. They also often have responsibility for children and looking after other people. Research shows that women are the shock absorbers of poverty because they're the ones making decisions about managing budgets.
Certainly for the women I've supported or had contact with who’ve been involved in selling or exchanging sex, poverty and money has been a big driver into the decision to get involved because they’ve felt there wasn’t any other choice, and this is a way for them to bring money in to meet their or their family’s needs.
You used that term, ‘easy money’ and that is how it’s portrayed. Women talk about that it seemed like it was easy money, but that there was nothing easy about it. Women have told us that at the start they earn more money, but with time their earning potential goes down because they are no longer “new” and therefore their “value” is less, to use a market analogy. What happens then is that women need to continue earning money but then punters start pushing women’s boundaries.
You said that women are the shock absorbers of poverty, can you tell me why are women being most impacted by the current Cost of Living crisis?
The nature of the work that women do can be precarious, they can often be working part-time because of caring responsibilities. So when costs are increasing, women already start from a point where they have less disposable income because of lesser earnings, and it becomes harder for them to withstand the shocks that come from things like COVID, inflation rises and the impact of Brexit and the war in Ukraine, etc. So when prices go up, women have to make decisions about eating or heating their home; and if they have children, they will prioritise them. The idea that women are shock absorbers is that they will do what they need to make sure their kids and other people in their care are OK ahead of themselves.
It’s getting harder and harder for lots of groups, but particularly for women who rely on benefits or who are in low paid work. The Joseph Rowntree Foundation just published a report around the deepening poverty experienced in Scotland, which showed that the poverty levels for black and minority ethic communities haven't been addressed at the same level as other groups have. It's those structural issues that often go unseen.
At the SWBG we have undertaken surveys with women and carried out some research with the Poverty Alliance, which shows some of the strategies that women are taking to try and cope with the crisis. For some women this has included skipping meals, not putting on the heating, not washing as often, not replacing clothes and shoes for themselves, and for a small number this has included considering selling content on Only Fans or escorting to financially support themselves and their families. The current economic context has shown us that as a woman you need to have a strong support network around you because women’s financial stability can be very fragile.
You were crucial in developing the Encompass Cost of Living briefing. Can you share what the specific impacts of this crisis have been on women who were already involved in selling or exchanging sex?
For those who potentially had savings previously, that's no longer there to withstand this crisis. Women are telling us that clients are pushing boundaries, expecting women to be the shock absorbers of this crisis as well – so demanding lower prices, pitting women against each other or expecting additional services for the same money they paid. Women are also seeing an increase in the risk of violence, with some women saying they're scared to put boundaries in place as they did previously because they worry that enforcing this could mean losing punters, and women need the money.
We also know that punters are well aware that women’s economic necessity often drives women’s involvement. We saw examples and stories of this during COVID, when men were using women’s financial situation to pressure women into removing boundaries (such as wearing condoms, meeting in a safe place) and around the acts they were willing to sell or exchange. The economic reality for women is that they don't have a financial safety net to fall back into, yet they’ve got bills and rent to pay, which is a vulnerability that punters are exploiting.
This analogy of women being the shock absorbers of punter’s poverty is really crucial, because it shows that punters still want sex but they are not willing to pay for it.
And it’s this male entitlement –they feel entitled to have their needs met and they will exploit the situation that women find themselves in financially to get that. Again, we saw this during COVID, with adverts placed on websites saying things like “if you are female and you're struggling to pay rent, come stay with me,” and also women saying punters would try to negotiate down prices. Women have also reported a risk of increased violence because men don't have the money to pay, but they will still partake and then use violence to get away without paying.
What can workers do when they hear that a woman they support is considering or has already started selling sex because she needs the money?
We know that there are often negative consequences for women involved in selling or exchanging sex, which can include increased risk of violence and abuse, and impact on mental, physical and sexual health; it can affect every part of women’s lives. While on the one hand we should balance that yes, someone’s bringing money in and they are meeting their financial needs through this, it’s about being aware that there can be other consequences.
If a woman they’re working with has been experiencing poverty, struggling to pay rent, to afford food, and suddenly seems to come into money, it is about asking: where's that money coming from? And following up by asking if selling sex is something she’s considered or has been involved in. This to make sure that we can support with those wider needs while recognising that there can be impacts for women who are involved. It's about looking at options and checking if it is something that she wants to do or something that she feels she has to do, and any alternatives that could help with her financial needs. If there aren't any and selling sex is something that a woman feels is helping her with money, is about looking together at the impact that this could have on her and how to support her with that. We need to do this, rather than assuming she's doing fine and she's happy with it. Even when someone is involved and they are OK with their involvement, there are still potential consequences that come from it, so it’s essential to take a harm reduction approach.
What money issues should workers be aware of when supporting women who they know or suspect to be involved in selling sex?
Money can often drive women's involvement in selling or exchanging sex, and becoming involved can actually be about having the opportunity to earn more money, to earn it in a potentially shorter time, and to do so in hours that suit other responsibilities. Selling sex is often portrayed as something that’s quite lucrative, and on the face of it, it can look like it’s something you can make a lot of money out of in the short term, but there can be huge implications for women’s lives in the longer term.
One of the things that was interesting from the Encompass Snapshot we did last year, is that for women who are currently involved or have been involved and are supported by Encompass services, the cost of living hasn’t made a massive difference because they have always faced financial hardship. And while the Cost of Living is exacerbating it, they’ve always struggled with things like paying for their utilities, having enough food or having a roof over their heads.
For women who are involved it is about making sure they've got access to advice. That their debt is being dealt with, that they are supported to access benefits, or if they’re in work that they can access all the financial support they are entitled to. It’s about looking at other options, for example, is there other work that would help address the financial issues that they are experiencing?
The problem is that often the work available to women is low paid and undervalued and so the options to be able to move out can be constrained. We know that deciding to stop selling or exchanging sex can exacerbate the poverty a woman is experiencing, and actually the work available to replace the money from selling sex can be less. So we need to be realistic and understand that often the financial issues that drove women in are there whilst they are involved and continue once they are thinking about stopping.
Why is it so crucial that workers from all types of services understand the complexities around money when it comes to selling sex?
It’s important to have that understanding so we can provide the holistic support that women often need. If we are trying to provide support and we don't have that understanding, then actually the options and choices we may offer aren’t realistic. We can't see women’s involvement in selling or exchanging sex as separate from the rest of their lives, because actually these things go hand in hand. We need to have that awareness so we can provide the best support.
In your view, what are some of the solutions to ensure the financial stability of women who are involved in selling or exchanging sex?
We need to look at the support that's available to individuals. Our UK benefits system doesn't provide that safety net that was envisaged when it was first developed and that's been slowly eroded over the last number of years, with a greater negative impact on women who are more likely to rely on it.
A lot of money has been put into support around Cost of Living crisis but this funding hasn’t been developed with women in mind. There’s an assumption that we are all starting from the same point and therefore the same amount of support is given to everybody. Actually we know that doesn't work, so we need to look at the financial support available. In England and Wales the government have just created a funding pot for women fleeing abusive partners, and the Scottish Government has committed to doing the same. We absolutely need something similar for women who are involved in commercial sexual exploitation, to support them particularly around exiting. But I also think we fundamentally need to look at what is the minimum income that people need so that we can support everyone.
In this interview, Heather delves into the complexities of money and poverty that can drive women into the ‘sex industry.’ We also discuss things frontline workers must consider when supporting women who are struggling financially and who are thinking or are already involved in selling or exchanging sex.
Could you start by telling us more about your experience working in the women’s sector?
I have been working in the women’s sector for about twenty years in a variety of roles primarily in the violence against women sector, including Women's Aid, Rape Crisis, the Encompass Network and Women’s Support Project. Within the Scottish Women's Budget Group I am the Training Lead, which involves delivering training to professionals in different public bodies as well as women’s community groups to look at inequality in their area and how gender budgeting approaches can help them to improve decisions that are taken which affect their lives.
What about the work you’ve done around women who sell or exchange sex?
I have also worked directly with women who sell or exchange sex. In the past, I’ve managed the Vice Versa service in Dundee which is one of the services in Scotland providing specific support to women involved. I've also supported the Encompass Network of specialist services; and I undertook frontline work at a Women’s Aid group , and some of the women I supported there were involved in selling or exchanging sex for a variety of reasons – some had been pressurised by partners and others got involved because of poverty, to cover bills or to fund their substance use.
In the Scottish Women's Budget Group (SWBG) you look at economics, poverty and financial inequality, which are things we don’t talk about enough when thinking of gender-based violence, can you tell me more about this perspective?
We talk a lot about violence against women being a cause and consequence of gender inequality, but what do we actually mean by that? We need to think about how those systemic and structural issues at times entrap women and play into the dependency that makes women more vulnerable to experiencing violence and abuse.
When we talk about vulnerabilities, we often see it as if there’s something wrong with the individual. But actually these are systemic issues that are responsible for causing some of the vulnerabilities that can increase women's risk of experiencing violence and abuse.
Money is one of the main things in people’s minds when thinking about women who sell sex, and there is often an assumption that selling sex is ‘easy money’. In your experience, what is the reality for women?
Gender inequality means that women are less likely to have savings or access to wealth generally within society. They also often have responsibility for children and looking after other people. Research shows that women are the shock absorbers of poverty because they're the ones making decisions about managing budgets.
Certainly for the women I've supported or had contact with who’ve been involved in selling or exchanging sex, poverty and money has been a big driver into the decision to get involved because they’ve felt there wasn’t any other choice, and this is a way for them to bring money in to meet their or their family’s needs.
You used that term, ‘easy money’ and that is how it’s portrayed. Women talk about that it seemed like it was easy money, but that there was nothing easy about it. Women have told us that at the start they earn more money, but with time their earning potential goes down because they are no longer “new” and therefore their “value” is less, to use a market analogy. What happens then is that women need to continue earning money but then punters start pushing women’s boundaries.
You said that women are the shock absorbers of poverty, can you tell me why are women being most impacted by the current Cost of Living crisis?
The nature of the work that women do can be precarious, they can often be working part-time because of caring responsibilities. So when costs are increasing, women already start from a point where they have less disposable income because of lesser earnings, and it becomes harder for them to withstand the shocks that come from things like COVID, inflation rises and the impact of Brexit and the war in Ukraine, etc. So when prices go up, women have to make decisions about eating or heating their home; and if they have children, they will prioritise them. The idea that women are shock absorbers is that they will do what they need to make sure their kids and other people in their care are OK ahead of themselves.
It’s getting harder and harder for lots of groups, but particularly for women who rely on benefits or who are in low paid work. The Joseph Rowntree Foundation just published a report around the deepening poverty experienced in Scotland, which showed that the poverty levels for black and minority ethic communities haven't been addressed at the same level as other groups have. It's those structural issues that often go unseen.
At the SWBG we have undertaken surveys with women and carried out some research with the Poverty Alliance, which shows some of the strategies that women are taking to try and cope with the crisis. For some women this has included skipping meals, not putting on the heating, not washing as often, not replacing clothes and shoes for themselves, and for a small number this has included considering selling content on Only Fans or escorting to financially support themselves and their families. The current economic context has shown us that as a woman you need to have a strong support network around you because women’s financial stability can be very fragile.
You were crucial in developing the Encompass Cost of Living briefing. Can you share what the specific impacts of this crisis have been on women who were already involved in selling or exchanging sex?
For those who potentially had savings previously, that's no longer there to withstand this crisis. Women are telling us that clients are pushing boundaries, expecting women to be the shock absorbers of this crisis as well – so demanding lower prices, pitting women against each other or expecting additional services for the same money they paid. Women are also seeing an increase in the risk of violence, with some women saying they're scared to put boundaries in place as they did previously because they worry that enforcing this could mean losing punters, and women need the money.
We also know that punters are well aware that women’s economic necessity often drives women’s involvement. We saw examples and stories of this during COVID, when men were using women’s financial situation to pressure women into removing boundaries (such as wearing condoms, meeting in a safe place) and around the acts they were willing to sell or exchange. The economic reality for women is that they don't have a financial safety net to fall back into, yet they’ve got bills and rent to pay, which is a vulnerability that punters are exploiting.
This analogy of women being the shock absorbers of punter’s poverty is really crucial, because it shows that punters still want sex but they are not willing to pay for it.
And it’s this male entitlement –they feel entitled to have their needs met and they will exploit the situation that women find themselves in financially to get that. Again, we saw this during COVID, with adverts placed on websites saying things like “if you are female and you're struggling to pay rent, come stay with me,” and also women saying punters would try to negotiate down prices. Women have also reported a risk of increased violence because men don't have the money to pay, but they will still partake and then use violence to get away without paying.
What can workers do when they hear that a woman they support is considering or has already started selling sex because she needs the money?
We know that there are often negative consequences for women involved in selling or exchanging sex, which can include increased risk of violence and abuse, and impact on mental, physical and sexual health; it can affect every part of women’s lives. While on the one hand we should balance that yes, someone’s bringing money in and they are meeting their financial needs through this, it’s about being aware that there can be other consequences.
If a woman they’re working with has been experiencing poverty, struggling to pay rent, to afford food, and suddenly seems to come into money, it is about asking: where's that money coming from? And following up by asking if selling sex is something she’s considered or has been involved in. This to make sure that we can support with those wider needs while recognising that there can be impacts for women who are involved. It's about looking at options and checking if it is something that she wants to do or something that she feels she has to do, and any alternatives that could help with her financial needs. If there aren't any and selling sex is something that a woman feels is helping her with money, is about looking together at the impact that this could have on her and how to support her with that. We need to do this, rather than assuming she's doing fine and she's happy with it. Even when someone is involved and they are OK with their involvement, there are still potential consequences that come from it, so it’s essential to take a harm reduction approach.
What money issues should workers be aware of when supporting women who they know or suspect to be involved in selling sex?
Money can often drive women's involvement in selling or exchanging sex, and becoming involved can actually be about having the opportunity to earn more money, to earn it in a potentially shorter time, and to do so in hours that suit other responsibilities. Selling sex is often portrayed as something that’s quite lucrative, and on the face of it, it can look like it’s something you can make a lot of money out of in the short term, but there can be huge implications for women’s lives in the longer term.
One of the things that was interesting from the Encompass Snapshot we did last year, is that for women who are currently involved or have been involved and are supported by Encompass services, the cost of living hasn’t made a massive difference because they have always faced financial hardship. And while the Cost of Living is exacerbating it, they’ve always struggled with things like paying for their utilities, having enough food or having a roof over their heads.
For women who are involved it is about making sure they've got access to advice. That their debt is being dealt with, that they are supported to access benefits, or if they’re in work that they can access all the financial support they are entitled to. It’s about looking at other options, for example, is there other work that would help address the financial issues that they are experiencing?
The problem is that often the work available to women is low paid and undervalued and so the options to be able to move out can be constrained. We know that deciding to stop selling or exchanging sex can exacerbate the poverty a woman is experiencing, and actually the work available to replace the money from selling sex can be less. So we need to be realistic and understand that often the financial issues that drove women in are there whilst they are involved and continue once they are thinking about stopping.
Why is it so crucial that workers from all types of services understand the complexities around money when it comes to selling sex?
It’s important to have that understanding so we can provide the holistic support that women often need. If we are trying to provide support and we don't have that understanding, then actually the options and choices we may offer aren’t realistic. We can't see women’s involvement in selling or exchanging sex as separate from the rest of their lives, because actually these things go hand in hand. We need to have that awareness so we can provide the best support.
In your view, what are some of the solutions to ensure the financial stability of women who are involved in selling or exchanging sex?
We need to look at the support that's available to individuals. Our UK benefits system doesn't provide that safety net that was envisaged when it was first developed and that's been slowly eroded over the last number of years, with a greater negative impact on women who are more likely to rely on it.
A lot of money has been put into support around Cost of Living crisis but this funding hasn’t been developed with women in mind. There’s an assumption that we are all starting from the same point and therefore the same amount of support is given to everybody. Actually we know that doesn't work, so we need to look at the financial support available. In England and Wales the government have just created a funding pot for women fleeing abusive partners, and the Scottish Government has committed to doing the same. We absolutely need something similar for women who are involved in commercial sexual exploitation, to support them particularly around exiting. But I also think we fundamentally need to look at what is the minimum income that people need so that we can support everyone.
